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I don't think writing two relatively polite posts and excusing themself from the convo is anywhere near Whatever from Shadow's behavior, man. Consider relaxing.
Posting here since SMR will probably just eat the submission.
imo I find sixdoctor's remade head redesigns (1) and *bakugames' fathom and dusthide redesigns (2) to be ugly and/or just not read as a dragon at all. **Like, you can definitely make more unique-looking dragons but neither of what they made looks appealing or something I'd want to see in-game over the current art. Almost like artstyle is subjective and just because you dislike someone's designs doesn't mean they're "not a great character designer."
1: https://www1.flightrising.com/forums/frd/3329820/33#post_56959147
2: https://www1.flightrising.com/forums/frd/3329820/34#post_56960314
*I will note that bakugames does have a lot of nice re-designs on their tumblr, just that what they drew for the thread looks like a dolphin with wings/legs stapled to it and the forbidden love child of a mole and an armadillo (i.e. they don't look like dragons).
**Batfossil had a snapper at one point with some gorgeous art that looked a lot like a mata mata turtle (desperately wish I could find it again--or at the least the artist ;-;) which, while not in FR's artstyle, I think is/was a great depiction of a bulkier and flatter dragon.
imo I find sixdoctor's remade head redesigns (1) and *bakugames' fathom and dusthide redesigns (2) to be ugly and/or just not read as a dragon at all. **Like, you can definitely make more unique-looking dragons but neither of what they made looks appealing or something I'd want to see in-game over the current art. Almost like artstyle is subjective and just because you dislike someone's designs doesn't mean they're "not a great character designer."
1: https://www1.flightrising.com/forums/frd/3329820/33#post_56959147
2: https://www1.flightrising.com/forums/frd/3329820/34#post_56960314
*I will note that bakugames does have a lot of nice re-designs on their tumblr, just that what they drew for the thread looks like a dolphin with wings/legs stapled to it and the forbidden love child of a mole and an armadillo (i.e. they don't look like dragons).
**Batfossil had a snapper at one point with some gorgeous art that looked a lot like a mata mata turtle (desperately wish I could find it again--or at the least the artist ;-;) which, while not in FR's artstyle, I think is/was a great depiction of a bulkier and flatter dragon.
I mean I can see what you mean but also moth was very polite and not annoying at all. They had one of the more pleasant exchanges I've seen in pvp forums so don't dog on 'em
Pinkerton has a fixed pool of items he can offer. Crim can ask for anything the devs have not explicitly removed from her ask logic. She asks for Eliminates all the time, for example, and Pinkerton cannot give those out.
The devs forgot how Pinkerton worked when the new achievements were designed and temporarily there was an impossible achievement to get a 4-star item from him. That achievement was deleted and replaced with a new achievement when it was pointed out.
Deets: https://www1.flightrising.com/forums/bug/3247301#post_3247301
The devs forgot how Pinkerton worked when the new achievements were designed and temporarily there was an impossible achievement to get a 4-star item from him. That achievement was deleted and replaced with a new achievement when it was pointed out.
Deets: https://www1.flightrising.com/forums/bug/3247301#post_3247301
ok really funny that when i start checking drama blogs again (because i wanted to catch up on things since i decided to post) i get mentioned in one. i deserve that i think LMFAOOOOOOO
idm if you think my guys are bad, though i will say i actually did draw the dusthide to look ugly and kinda nasty, because I think that type of design rules. I actually feel like a lot of my old redesigns feel too safe and I wouldn't draw them like that.
But also I do believe a dragon is anything that says that its a dragon. Modern western dragons are just lizards with dog legs and wings stapled on them (sometimes), i think stapling other things is funny.
Actually know what would be funny. they should release a dog dragon. i dont even like dog designs but i want to see what that would look like
idm if you think my guys are bad, though i will say i actually did draw the dusthide to look ugly and kinda nasty, because I think that type of design rules. I actually feel like a lot of my old redesigns feel too safe and I wouldn't draw them like that.
But also I do believe a dragon is anything that says that its a dragon. Modern western dragons are just lizards with dog legs and wings stapled on them (sometimes), i think stapling other things is funny.
Actually know what would be funny. they should release a dog dragon. i dont even like dog designs but i want to see what that would look like
I'd rather a design that doesn't "feel like a dragon" to a portion of the playerbase (I'd disagree on their Fathom redesign; it reads like an aquatic dragon to me, but as you said it's subjective) and have more varied designs than what we're getting. I agree with one of Baku's earlier posts: "Despite so many of the dragons in here supposedly being inspired by various concepts and mythologies, they tend to fall in one of the generic dragon body type molds (quadrupedal canine setup with a lizard-y head, wyvern setup and tube)."
It's dragons! Why can't we push the mold even a little, y'know?
It's dragons! Why can't we push the mold even a little, y'know?
also do you remember if the snapper was M or F and the name of the skin... I love mata mata turtles, I want to see that skin so bad
SA
Its also kinda funny to me how much pushback there is on asking for a little bit of body diversity - If I were in there I'd be batting for weird ass designs like Apep that is only a dragon because Genshin says it's a dragon. It's cool! It's unique! It's interesting! Is it for everyone? No! But it's not like Bogsneaks are, or Fae, or Wildclaws. I think it's a poor choice to not be going for things that are different than what we've already got, especially in terms of ancients.
Apep, for those who don't know what it looks like: https://staticg.sportskeeda.com/editor/2023/04/ec25f-16812907576864-1920.jpg
(Sorry I don't know how to do the codes here)
Its also kinda funny to me how much pushback there is on asking for a little bit of body diversity - If I were in there I'd be batting for weird ass designs like Apep that is only a dragon because Genshin says it's a dragon. It's cool! It's unique! It's interesting! Is it for everyone? No! But it's not like Bogsneaks are, or Fae, or Wildclaws. I think it's a poor choice to not be going for things that are different than what we've already got, especially in terms of ancients.
Apep, for those who don't know what it looks like: https://staticg.sportskeeda.com/editor/2023/04/ec25f-16812907576864-1920.jpg
(Sorry I don't know how to do the codes here)
The "my style is a bit closer to frs house style" from bakugames bit is strange because their style is sure as hell not closer. The other breed redesigns they've done are so far removed from the site's style:
https://bakugames-fr.tumblr.com/tagged/breed%20redesigns
Like, I get the sentiment there should be more diverse dragon body types, but attempting to use such a highly different style as a counterpoint does not help imo. You're better off looking at other things staff artists have done like osiem whose literal job is to make art assets within FR's style.
https://osiemfr.tumblr.com/post/188055573257/slimesludge-step-by-step-link-waspbee-step-by
Or even that one other Dusthide redesign set from a user who is closer to site style.
https://flightdescending.tumblr.com/post/748596922129039360/ok-so-this-started-because-the-thing-about
https://bakugames-fr.tumblr.com/tagged/breed%20redesigns
Like, I get the sentiment there should be more diverse dragon body types, but attempting to use such a highly different style as a counterpoint does not help imo. You're better off looking at other things staff artists have done like osiem whose literal job is to make art assets within FR's style.
https://osiemfr.tumblr.com/post/188055573257/slimesludge-step-by-step-link-waspbee-step-by
Or even that one other Dusthide redesign set from a user who is closer to site style.
https://flightdescending.tumblr.com/post/748596922129039360/ok-so-this-started-because-the-thing-about
AYRT
I'm admittedly biased in that I'm kind of a dragon purist; I consider dragons to be amphibian, reptilian or dinosaur-like (including avian) in some form (highly insectiod and piscian dragons I tolerate). I generally also prefer reptiles and birds (all dinos in general) to mammals, and so again am biased against mammalian designs (my least favorite dragon breeds design-wise are the mammalian ones; ironically am not keen on SDs or WCs though). Agree that FR could push their designs more, though perhaps not the full extent some people want (realize I sound pretty hypocritical considering my original post). Disappointed we did not get a crocodile, turtle, any of the extinct marine reptiles, or salamander/diplocaulus for fathoms.
RE: snapper art
Realized I mispoke: the skin itself was not mata mata-like, but batfossil commissioned someone to draw art of their dragon that looked mata mata-like (especially the head) if I remember it correctly. Unfortunately I don't think the dragon is in batfossil's lair anymore or is no longer a snapper since I went to look for it today and couldn't find it (even in dragon search). It was an f-pose g1 snapper with the skin tarnished pedagogue, and was in their the dunes tab (I think it was green with a blue stain). Pretty certain the same artist sold dragons with art in their bios, including a heron skydancer and a python spiral; they also had a young-ish lair with lots of g1 banescales iirc if that rings a bell. I saved the snapper art on my phone at one point because it was great daydream material but unfortunately can't find the picture anymore, and sadly the tab doesn't appear to be archived in the wayback machine.
I'm admittedly biased in that I'm kind of a dragon purist; I consider dragons to be amphibian, reptilian or dinosaur-like (including avian) in some form (highly insectiod and piscian dragons I tolerate). I generally also prefer reptiles and birds (all dinos in general) to mammals, and so again am biased against mammalian designs (my least favorite dragon breeds design-wise are the mammalian ones; ironically am not keen on SDs or WCs though). Agree that FR could push their designs more, though perhaps not the full extent some people want (realize I sound pretty hypocritical considering my original post). Disappointed we did not get a crocodile, turtle, any of the extinct marine reptiles, or salamander/diplocaulus for fathoms.
RE: snapper art
Realized I mispoke: the skin itself was not mata mata-like, but batfossil commissioned someone to draw art of their dragon that looked mata mata-like (especially the head) if I remember it correctly. Unfortunately I don't think the dragon is in batfossil's lair anymore or is no longer a snapper since I went to look for it today and couldn't find it (even in dragon search). It was an f-pose g1 snapper with the skin tarnished pedagogue, and was in their the dunes tab (I think it was green with a blue stain). Pretty certain the same artist sold dragons with art in their bios, including a heron skydancer and a python spiral; they also had a young-ish lair with lots of g1 banescales iirc if that rings a bell. I saved the snapper art on my phone at one point because it was great daydream material but unfortunately can't find the picture anymore, and sadly the tab doesn't appear to be archived in the wayback machine.
I don't think being a dragon purist is an issue (or at least one that matters LOL), though i do think we do have a bunch of very draconic, standard, pretty #cool dragons for people who prefer that, and it'd be fun to reach out to broader horizons. It won't be everyones favorite, but we have sooo many breeds that I think wilder swings and creating lasting iconic designs, even if some people think theyre awful is super cool!!
Because if i get my silly weird dolphin and mole rat dragons, that means you could get your turtle and crocodile dragons too, instead of us both just getting lukewarm designs that no one has major feelings on. Does that make sense?
ALSO NOOOOOOOOOO this is so sad... I'll see if I can find the skin anyway tomorrow </3
Because if i get my silly weird dolphin and mole rat dragons, that means you could get your turtle and crocodile dragons too, instead of us both just getting lukewarm designs that no one has major feelings on. Does that make sense?
ALSO NOOOOOOOOOO this is so sad... I'll see if I can find the skin anyway tomorrow </3
getting off topic but it's mythic plus that shouldn't have been added, especially since that's the entire game now
I do agree that we could do with more body variation and I enjoy a lot of hypothetical redesigns (even though I don’t think all of them suit FR’s art style).
…but I do feel like the OP of the FR Art Direction Thread is a little bit disingenuous with some of their sketch-overs. Like, idk I don’t think that aberration, undertide, and banescale heads are the same. Like they could’ve gotten More different with it but they’re about as different as guardians, wildclaws, and imperials.
…but I do feel like the OP of the FR Art Direction Thread is a little bit disingenuous with some of their sketch-overs. Like, idk I don’t think that aberration, undertide, and banescale heads are the same. Like they could’ve gotten More different with it but they’re about as different as guardians, wildclaws, and imperials.
Huh! Thanks.
She's never asked for an Eliminate from me, fwiw.
She's never asked for an Eliminate from me, fwiw.
read the thread and OP seems to be bitching about basically a nonissue. They bring up some alright points (breeds released around launch were more varied and interesting, which I agree with), but then they basically just go "...therefore there need to be more ugly dragons!" and show the most godawful gross looking sketches. genuinely the designs are so ugly and subjective. looking at their redesigns make me GRATEFUL for what the site has put out lately. as much as I hate undertides at least they dont look like any of these https://web.archive.org/web/20240611071016/https://64.media.tumblr.com/5341e58e2b31db9911d3df10003a86c3/8ada316c98ded51e-5a/s2048x3072/52d9fa2971946057d1bacd2453517262ad61a8a6.png
god they make me shudder looking at them theyre just *bad*. they may be fine as individual or oc designs, but imagine those as actual FR dragons. the solution to "same face syndrome" isnt "make everything an eyesore" my god
god they make me shudder looking at them theyre just *bad*. they may be fine as individual or oc designs, but imagine those as actual FR dragons. the solution to "same face syndrome" isnt "make everything an eyesore" my god
I am mildly annoyed at some of the redesigns/suggestions, they are either:
1/Do not look like dragons.
2/Aren't drawn into a square (yes many can be easily redrawn to fit into a box, but this is a limit factor I feel most people don't think to)
3/Small wings so they don't have enough space to show secondary, the colors will look unbalanced. The same goes for any Pangolin-like design where the plates cover half the body.
(Dusthide F has this problem, the male pose has a much better color ratio. But it is a design choice to show that the outer wings have the same color as the body, so when Dusthides are in ball mode they will have a solid color. Additionally, the area where the back wing touches the head gives accent artists plenty of room for head accessories.)
4/Modern breeds must have simple designs to dress up. They also need to have safe concepts or else the player base will be upset that they had waited for years just to get an ugly breed (poor Bogsneak)
I agree that ancient breeds could have pushed the design further, especially with how fast devs can make them now, but some critics do not think about color ratio, site mechanics, and user expectations.
1/Do not look like dragons.
2/Aren't drawn into a square (yes many can be easily redrawn to fit into a box, but this is a limit factor I feel most people don't think to)
3/Small wings so they don't have enough space to show secondary, the colors will look unbalanced. The same goes for any Pangolin-like design where the plates cover half the body.
(Dusthide F has this problem, the male pose has a much better color ratio. But it is a design choice to show that the outer wings have the same color as the body, so when Dusthides are in ball mode they will have a solid color. Additionally, the area where the back wing touches the head gives accent artists plenty of room for head accessories.)
4/Modern breeds must have simple designs to dress up. They also need to have safe concepts or else the player base will be upset that they had waited for years just to get an ugly breed (poor Bogsneak)
I agree that ancient breeds could have pushed the design further, especially with how fast devs can make them now, but some critics do not think about color ratio, site mechanics, and user expectations.
I don’t have anything useful to add to the conversation, but can I just say that I feel like I’m back in 2014 and we’re having disney Frozen sameface discourse again
Amen.
I hate being treated like I'm a lesser raider because I won't spend countless hours chasing stupid hard mode dungeons like that.
I hate being treated like I'm a lesser raider because I won't spend countless hours chasing stupid hard mode dungeons like that.
AYRT
Valid, I was in a terrible mood when I saw their posts yesterday and the fact they kept making long responses just irked me haha. In hindsight they aren't as bad as I made them out to be. I do still think they should probably stop responding to the convo tho
Valid, I was in a terrible mood when I saw their posts yesterday and the fact they kept making long responses just irked me haha. In hindsight they aren't as bad as I made them out to be. I do still think they should probably stop responding to the convo tho
AYRT
Yeah I realize that now ^^' definitely just overreacted when I saw them saying not to bring them back into the conversation because they were writing a bunch.
Yeah I realize that now ^^' definitely just overreacted when I saw them saying not to bring them back into the conversation because they were writing a bunch.
God I wish Aethers had been those both dragons from Osiem instead. So fuzzy. So cute. Actually has an (albeit short) snout.
I like several of Bakugames' designs too, for the record. That Guardian in particular feels like something I could see on the site. I'd really like to see a crocodilian-inspired dragon in general - I feel like their headshape could perhaps be a good compromise between "more unique shapes" and "still looks very dragon-y"
Also this may be an unpopular opinion but I'd replace Wildclaws with Bakugames's version in a heartbeat. Current Wildclaws are probably my least favorite breed design, all naked-looking and weirdly structure
I like several of Bakugames' designs too, for the record. That Guardian in particular feels like something I could see on the site. I'd really like to see a crocodilian-inspired dragon in general - I feel like their headshape could perhaps be a good compromise between "more unique shapes" and "still looks very dragon-y"
Also this may be an unpopular opinion but I'd replace Wildclaws with Bakugames's version in a heartbeat. Current Wildclaws are probably my least favorite breed design, all naked-looking and weirdly structure
*moth dragons, not both dragons. Although the other design is cool, too
this is just my own opinion on your opinions, but i thought id reply because i do think this topic is fun to discuss
1. pretty subjective imo. Dragons are much more a narrative concept than a solid mythos. Theyve had various designs, versions, variations all with different animals inspiring them, including straight up normal humans (thomas real?). A dragon is what the story needs, and flight rising has so many normal draconic dragons, I don't see why they couldnt have weirder ones imo.
2. the designs that people have offered in general seem pretty easy to put in boxes, especially the larger ones as they tend to have silhouettes without major branches. designs like spirals and auraboas are much more of a nightmare with the extreme flairs and random decals, which is why auraboras have pretty awful silhouettes and spirals look super off when flipped.
3. I never saw this as a big issue. snappers are my favorites and their secondary space is pretty dire, and thats ok imo! if anything, having dragons with unbalanced proportions lets people get away and do things that you wont really with 1:1 prim:sec spacing. also itd be so cute if the plates were secondaries.
4. Being honest, i dont think thats really true anymore. We get one to two dragons per year, and theyre starting to feel like less of an event and more like a mini update everyone is expecting. Of course moderns will always take longer, but ive seen quite a few people mentioning how they dont care that much despite them being moderns because of the overall dragon saturation. we also, again, have SO many dragons. Id much rather they have a clear vision and say something and be loved by some and hated by others, than this stream of everyone being lukewarm and then moving on to not caring. some said they straight up forgot sandsurges exist and thats wild
1. pretty subjective imo. Dragons are much more a narrative concept than a solid mythos. Theyve had various designs, versions, variations all with different animals inspiring them, including straight up normal humans (thomas real?). A dragon is what the story needs, and flight rising has so many normal draconic dragons, I don't see why they couldnt have weirder ones imo.
2. the designs that people have offered in general seem pretty easy to put in boxes, especially the larger ones as they tend to have silhouettes without major branches. designs like spirals and auraboas are much more of a nightmare with the extreme flairs and random decals, which is why auraboras have pretty awful silhouettes and spirals look super off when flipped.
3. I never saw this as a big issue. snappers are my favorites and their secondary space is pretty dire, and thats ok imo! if anything, having dragons with unbalanced proportions lets people get away and do things that you wont really with 1:1 prim:sec spacing. also itd be so cute if the plates were secondaries.
4. Being honest, i dont think thats really true anymore. We get one to two dragons per year, and theyre starting to feel like less of an event and more like a mini update everyone is expecting. Of course moderns will always take longer, but ive seen quite a few people mentioning how they dont care that much despite them being moderns because of the overall dragon saturation. we also, again, have SO many dragons. Id much rather they have a clear vision and say something and be loved by some and hated by others, than this stream of everyone being lukewarm and then moving on to not caring. some said they straight up forgot sandsurges exist and thats wild
Tbf, vexillography is an art form in of itself with its own guidelines.
these people just cant accept that their tastes are niche. they like ugly and distinctive things over more generic "nice" things, but most people actually dont. the breeds theyre proposing probably wouldnt be popular. its not a problem that the fr dragons are mass appeal, its intentional, thats a necessary part of petsite design.
they talk about themselves like there the silent majority, but the real silent majority is the reason theres 3x as many skydancers as there are ridgebacks,or why wildclaws are the most popular uma base despite all the complaints from this crowd about how "boring" they are. people like boring and safe.
its a shame they cant find something that appeals to them, but its a petsite, part of the genre is having kinda generic designs that people can customize and make their own. its fine if they want to make custom designs that fit their tastes, but they shouldnt pretend that those designs are objectively better or would be more popular. not everybody has the same taste
they talk about themselves like there the silent majority, but the real silent majority is the reason theres 3x as many skydancers as there are ridgebacks,or why wildclaws are the most popular uma base despite all the complaints from this crowd about how "boring" they are. people like boring and safe.
its a shame they cant find something that appeals to them, but its a petsite, part of the genre is having kinda generic designs that people can customize and make their own. its fine if they want to make custom designs that fit their tastes, but they shouldnt pretend that those designs are objectively better or would be more popular. not everybody has the same taste
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