anonrerising | Spring into Salt

i appreciate the lengths they went to for cultural sensitivity but the process sounds absolutely exhausting

it was always my understanding that open cultures and their mythology, which i thought included most eastern cultures, were generally considered "okay" to draw inspiration, from never mind reference obliquely as would have been the case with a kirin.

has that attitude changed? or is the kirin more sacred of an animal compared to say a lion dog (which also has familiars inspired by it) or something like the sphinx (tomb guardians/sacred animals in ancient egypt) and required more care in handling?

to my understanding there's been an ongoing discussion (especially since the auraboa incident) about how east asian cultures are referenced and portrayed within the wind flight (and how much of that is appropriative), so to avoid something like the auraboa incident happening again they went above and beyond with covering their bases

ayrt that's even stranger to me because iirc the only thing "east asian" that wind really has going on is the fact it has bamboo?? and maybe the bamboo falls venue resembling an asian water garden or something.

spirals don't resemble lung dragons in the slightest (that's imperials) and i can't think of any wind fest apparel that appeared heavily influenced by the culture either.

but even so i guess i still was under the impression that many open cultures indeed want their culture shared? which included having things be inspired by it and becoming their own thing.

The wind flight's ambassador familiar is a kitsune, so there's also that.

kirin/qilin/girin/etc are not sacred and it's fine, and actually pretty cool, to see people have their own take on them

i personally would rather have just seen fr's take on a creature from my culture rather than... Whatever they're doing

there's already tons of references or inspiration to real life culture or mythology in fr, i don't like that it feels like they're tiptoeing so hard around an east asian inspired dragon that they're attempting to remove the asian from it =/

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Cirrus leaning harder into the girin inspiration the exact opposite of removing the Asian aspect from it?

>Our consultant suggested two possible paths, to either lean in fully or avoid altogether. With the breed already having all of the genes and artwork created at this point, and with the specialist’s own enthusiasm for the concept of including more accurate girin attributes, we were strongly encouraged to lean in fully and make this ancient more girin-inspired.

>Leaning in fully to celebrate the girin was admittedly the faster fix, one that allowed us to make smaller changes to the art to correct the Westernization. We remained committed to ultimately doing the right thing while still hoping we could find ways to incorporate the feedback that wouldn’t mean starting over from square one. Working closely with our consultant, our art team put together series of workable changes based on their feedback and has been hard at work updating the gene art since.

Copy/pasting the specific parts for clarity.

huh. i thought that by making the girin fam they were acknowledging the westernization of their design, i guess I misread bc their design is ... well, idk that i'd say their design is "westernized" necessarily. but it's not at all what id call "fully leaning into" the inspiration. it's more "qilin inspired" than "a qilin". (replace qilin with girin or kirin or gilen)

sa

which is fine to make a design that is merely /inspired/ by qilin, imo!

but it feels hella condescending and white guilt-y to have several paragraphs about wanting to be culturally sensitive and "leaning into" the qilin inspiration and then they show us a horse/unicorn dragon with paws. i think the design is pretty, fwiw, and im excited to see that foal.

but it's got about as much in common with a qilin as obelisks do with guardian lions/shishi. which is to say that there's an obvious Inspira there, but it's not A Qilin, nor is it "fully leaning into" the inspiration.

It does feel, as you put it, "white guilt-y", but I don't think it's performative or intended to be condescending. I think staff has just been burned by the type of fanbase FR has cultivated in the last decade one too many times and are playing it safe. (From their perspective. I think they're damned if they do and damned if they don't and am not sure I would have handled this the way they did, TBH.)

I'm hazarding a guess in that some of the design choices were made to make it feel more like a dragon, since they also acknowledge that the qilin (etc) is generally not considered a "dragon". So there was probably a balancing act of 'leaning into' and 'but also make it a dragon' that might be clashing. I think.

yeah, i think this is it.

it's more "qilin inspired" than "a qilin". (replace qilin with girin or kirin or gilen)

Aeq has clarified multiple times that's the point. The wind ancient is a dragon, a qilin/kirin/girin is not. They made the familiar a more true version of a girin.

-the Cirrus dragon is a gem breed. This would mean we’re placing content heavily inspired by and borrowing from a specific culture into our premium currency marketplace.

-
this gives us the chance to *****draw a clearer line between the girin and Cirrus dragons****** while still celebrating the rich art history, myths, and folklore that have inspired so many.

I literally look at it every time and I'm just like "That's a generic af Kirin" they didn't lean away from anything besides just replacing the hooves with toes

and it feels, to me, a person who is asian

like they have removed some of the "asian flavour" to make this breed

and the paragraphs of talking about striving to be culturally sensitive after showing the design, as a result, feels condescending. particularly in a "white guilt" way. this is not an unfamiliar feeling for many poc.

not to mention the comment above what youre replying to, where they state they "fully leaned in" to the qilin design. so ... did they or didn't they?

if they showed off the breed and /just/ said it was loosely inspired by qilin, full stop, no white guilt handwringing about cultural appropriation for drawing a mythological made-up hybrid animal, i wouldnt have any salt about it. i like the design, even, and im excited for the horsies. im irritated by the text accompanying it and came to the bitching anon comm to bitch about it.

tl;dr it's just like my opinion man

Yeah I definitely think they should have been like "here's our new kirin inspired dragon :)" (and MAYBE thrown in the bit about working with a cultural sensitivity expert?) and left it at that.

The more they explain, the more avenues they give people to criticize them. I know they're trying to clear the air, from their perspective, but... I feel like it usually has the opposite effect???

Spring into Salt

Re: Wind Ancient

Re: Wind Ancient

Re: Wind Ancient

Re: Wind Ancient

Re: Wind Ancient

Re: Wind Ancient

Re: Wind Ancient

Re: Wind Ancient

Re: Wind Ancient

Re: Wind Ancient

Re: Wind Ancient

Re: Wind Ancient

Re: Wind Ancient

Re: Wind Ancient

Re: Wind Ancient